A Club of Liars, Demagogues and Ignoramuses

[Rafal Dudek]

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,800850,00.html

The US Republican race is dominated by ignorance, lies and scandals. The current crop of candidates have shown such a basic lack of knowledge that they make George W. Bush look like Einstein. The Grand Old Party is ruining the entire country's reputation.

That was the single most honest article about the GOP race I've ever read. I'm trying to put a list of everyone that I'll be voting out next year, but it looks like I may have to vote Obama. Seriously, GOP has no one.

[NotSoFast]

Yeah, I see what you mean. Afterall, Obama is doing so well up to this point. I wouldn't vote for that dirtbag if it meant saving a bus load of children from certain death. :doa:

[Terry Penrod]

.

Why can't we all admit that both major parties are bursting at the seams with liars, demagogues and ignoramuses?

However, I do not believe either Barack Obama or Mitt Romney is an idiot.

I don't trust either of them, but they aren't stupid.

Given that opinion and assuming they are the final two candidates for president next year, I plan to throw darts at their pictures blindfolded and vote for whichever liar gets hit between the eyes.

Cheers, Terry

[Rob]

Glenn, here is the problem I see for the Republicans. Right now, Obama is incredibly unpopular, which would suggest people would like to see a change. This was the exact position Bush was in after his first term, but then the Democrats sent Kerry up against Bush. The Republicans did not win that election, the Democrats lost it with such a weak candidate. The Republicans are in such a position now, people dislike Obama, but many of the Republicans running are pathetic. More troubling is if any break off from the party and run as an independent, such as Ron Paul has suggested he may do, this may further diminish votes for a Republican candidate, leaving Obama the front runner.

All said and done, I have absolutely no trust in the government. My only interest is not voting in some warmonger who has a US against the world attitude and who will bring us to war. In that regard, I do prefer Obama.

[Rafal Dudek]

That's the thing, there is no one to vote for that actually deserves the vote!

[NotSoFast]

That's the thing, there is no one to vote for that actually deserves the vote!

Obama has already proven in the past 3 years that he did not deserve a vote, so anyone running against Captain Socialism gets my vote by default. I certainly am no Bush fan, but things have only gotten worse in this term. Nothing even shows a hint of improving.

[Rafal Dudek]

so anyone running against Captain Socialism gets my vote by default.

Even when they're complete idiots or hypocrites? How is that solving the original problem of putting someone into office that will actually serve the people?

Here is the problem, nothing will get done because of the mentality of "if you're not with us, you're against us".

Whatever Obama tries to pass, gets killed by the reps. Whatever reps try to pass, gets killed by the dems. What is the ******* point? Tell me?

People spew ******** out of their mouths saying "ohhh he sucks, he didn't do anything" but they miss the fact that they just ******* CAN'T do anything due to the way our politicians behave.

[draco7891]

Forget the President (although I agree, there isn't a single candidate worth voting for on either side).

You want real change, you want to really punish the dirty scumbags that screw with your liberties and steal your money and enact all kinds of hare-brained idiocy? Care about your Congresspeople.

Congress is the one that drafts new laws. Congress is the one that appropriates funds to projects. Congress is the one that cannot decide whether the FAA is a good thing for four concurrent years now.

Everyone gets all up in arms over the Presidency because that's what the media wants to sell you. And Congress enjoys something like an 85-90% incumbency rate, because no one knows who they are, or what they do--they're just the "other names I always pick" on the ballot. And America doesn't change, because the same childish, asinine, frighteningly ignorant morons get to hold onto the pursestrings and build laws.

So, forget who is going to be the President. Doesn't matter. Get rid of your Congresspeople. Find out who is running in your districts. Find out what they stand for. Find out about their voting and attendance records.

Pick a better Congressperson.

Draco

[Terry Penrod]

.

Forget the President (although I agree, there isn't a single candidate worth voting for on either side).

You want real change, you want to really punish the dirty scumbags that screw with your liberties and steal your money and enact all kinds of hare-brained idiocy? Care about your Congresspeople.

Congress is the one that drafts new laws. Congress is the one that appropriates funds to projects. Congress is the one that cannot decide whether the FAA is a good thing for four concurrent years now.

Everyone gets all up in arms over the Presidency because that's what the media wants to sell you. And Congress enjoys something like an 85-90% incumbency rate, because no one knows who they are, or what they do--they're just the "other names I always pick" on the ballot. And America doesn't change, because the same childish, asinine, frighteningly ignorant morons get to hold onto the pursestrings and build laws.

So, forget who is going to be the President. Doesn't matter. Get rid of your Congresspeople. Find out who is running in your districts. Find out what they stand for. Find out about their voting and attendance records.

Pick a better Congressperson.

Draco

Unfortunately, the exact same faults can be said about most voters.

They too are selfish, shortsighted and ignorant.

Politics in America is corrupt through and through because average citizens either don't care enough to vote or they vote for whichever candidate tells them the lies they want to hear.

So we get a perpetual flow of liars into elected offices who get there by telling conflicting lies to self-serving constituents - some of whom are barely literate with all sorts of whacked-out ideas running through their pointy little heads.

Once in office, the level of selfishness and dishonesty increases tenfold with paid lobbyists and plain, old bag men representing a full spectrum of conflicting special interests tempting them with lots of money and lavish favors.

As Edward keeps saying, it's all about greed - all about ME ME ME and that applies equally to the majority of voters, not just the shills they elect to office and the dirtbags who buy/sell those shills like street pimps.

The only lasting solution is to develop MUCH better educated, motivated voters who persistently demand honest, intelligent government. From there, we could at least hold a decent, ongoing national dialog by citizens to work-out our differences, weed-out the biggest lies and reach an honest, practical compromise on the biggest issues. The rest would be simple execution of a true majority consensus.

Cheers, Terry

.

[Rafal Dudek]

The only lasting solution is to develop MUCH better educated, motivated voters who persistently demand honest, intelligent government.

Isn't there a republican candidate that wants to eliminate the department of education? :p: Why educate the population when you can make them as dumb as a rock so it's easier to sway their votes toward your lies? :):

[Impresario]

.
The only lasting solution is to develop MUCH better educated, motivated voters who persistently demand honest, intelligent government. From there, we could at least hold a decent, ongoing national dialog by citizens to work-out our differences, weed-out the biggest lies and reach an honest, practical compromise on the biggest issues. The rest would be simple execution of a true majority consensus.
.
How do you develop a functioning future body politic when so many kids in this country are growing up under impossible domestic conditions? http://datacenter.kidscount.org/data/acrossstates/Rankings.aspx?ind=53, and isn't it far beyond the scope or ability of public education to remedy these systemic issues?

In a somewhat related matter this seems indicative of the many failings we've experienced over the last decade. http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/01/opinion/kristof-a-banker-speaks-with-regret.html?_r=1

Reminds me of that old Pink Floyd song...
Money
It's a hit
Don't give me that do goody good bullsheet
I'm in the high-fidelity first class travelling set
I think I need a Lear jet

[Terry Penrod]

.

How do you develop a functioning future body politic when so many kids in this country are growing up under impossible domestic conditions? http://datacenter.kidscount.org/data/acrossstates/Rankings.aspx?ind=53, and isn't it far beyond the scope or ability of public education to remedy these systemic issues?

In a somewhat related matter this seems indicative of the many failings we've experienced over the last decade. http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/01/opinion/kristof-a-banker-speaks-with-regret.html?_r=1

Reminds me of that old Pink Floyd song...
Money
It's a hit
Don't give me that do goody good bullsheet
I'm in the high-fidelity first class travelling set
I think I need a Lear jet

I agree that improving the quality of education in America would not fix all our problems.

But it would have many direct benefits to students / graduates leading to indirect benefits for communities and the nation as a whole.

The mortagage lending mess is a different issue.

Cheers, Terry

P.S. While growing up in a single-parent home with very little money does put children at a disadvantage, it is not an impossibe situation to overcome.

[NotSoFast]

Even when they're complete idiots or hypocrites? How is that solving the original problem of putting someone into office that will actually serve the people?

Here is the problem, nothing will get done because of the mentality of "if you're not with us, you're against us".

Whatever Obama tries to pass, gets killed by the reps. Whatever reps try to pass, gets killed by the dems. What is the ******* point? Tell me?

People spew ******** out of their mouths saying "ohhh he sucks, he didn't do anything" but they miss the fact that they just ******* CAN'T do anything due to the way our politicians behave.

Obama has been proven to be the wrong choice. A second term won't change that. At least if it's a different person, ignorant or not, there is at least a CHANCE of improvement.

Democrats (particularly overly liberal ones like Obama) are voted into office (mainly) by pandering to those who want to live off of the system and by those who actually think that more social services actually "help" the lower class. What this system does is breed generation after generation of people looking to the government to provide them with their livelihoods. Ever wonder why no one in the projects votes for Republicans? This is why the Democrats constantly recruit in these areas. Just look at the "Acorn" group as an example.

I believe in American citizens working for what they receive and being able to keep as much of it away from the government as humanly possible. This is why I did not and will not ever vote for Obama or any other liberal. If you are physically capable to do ANY job, then you should be out there doing what you can to support yourself and your family. The government should rely on the people to survive, not the other way around.

[Terry Penrod]

.

Obama has been proven to be the wrong choice. A second term won't change that. At least if it's a different person, ignorant or not, there is at least a CHANCE of improvement.

Democrats (particularly overly liberal ones like Obama) are voted into office (mainly) by pandering to those who want to live off of the system and by those who actually think that more social services actually "help" the lower class. What this system does is breed generation after generation of people looking to the government to provide them with their livelihoods. Ever wonder why no one in the projects votes for Republicans? This is why the Democrats constantly recruit in these areas. Just look at the "Acorn" group as an example.

I believe in American citizens working for what they receive and being able to keep as much of it away from the government as humanly possible. This is why I did not and will not ever vote for Obama or any other liberal. If you are physically capable to do ANY job, then you should be out there doing what you can to support yourself and your family. The government should rely on the people to survive, not the other way around.


I don't disagree with any of your main points, NSF.

But there are other issues to consider beyond our current economic problems and what is in fact a perpetual welfare state in America.

For example, investing in aggressive programs to improve education for the sake of creating a more competitive, self-reliant workforce and developing better sources of affordable, renewable energy to gain freedom from OPEC would be very wise investments for our country.

If we don't put forth a real effort to make our public schools more effective and if we keep relying so heavily on foreign oil from unstable nations, we might as well give up right now.

No doubt we have many other pressing needs as well, but those two things should be given very high priority because they are keys to fixing a huge number of long-term problems that will seriously impact us on multiple levels including economic, military, environmental, social and other.

America has led the world through innovation, education and determination. We need to renew our commitment to those fundamental elements and we need to do it now.

Cutting entitlement programs and capping budgets will only get us so far. We need some real game changers and that means taking some big risks and making some real sacrifices, which can not happen as long as we continue following this course of stubborn, deadlocked partisanship in a vessel full of selfish, greedy, dishonest, shortsighted people.

Smarter citizens / voters and smarter energy programs will make America stronger. If we can accomplish those things, we will have a much better chance of also fixing our economic, welfare, healthcare and other problems.

Cheers, Terry

[Mighty Pirate]

I truly believe the decision to run Sarah Palin was a deliberate and canny act of self-sabotage by the Republicans because they knew how bad the economy was and that they didn't have the solution so they 'allowed' the Democrats to snatch the poisoned chalice.

I don't expect anyone is really keen to move into the White House and take the blame for the next round of economic hardships that are definitely heading our way.

However, I know all about having to vote and there being no one you want and no policies you can believe in. Politically we're all in the doldrums but what the world needs now is clear and inspiring leadership: someone with vision.

[OldsterHolster]

Bah! Democrat, Republican, Liberal, Conservative, what's the diff? I voted for Obama because he mirrored a lot of my own thoughts, but I'd vote Republican if any of them would talk straight, too. In fact, I kind of like Ron Paul's take on things, but the fact is the whole friggin' system is broken, and greed still rules. They've demonized "Obamacare," but who else has made ANY attempt to reform the health care debacle in this country? Hospitals still charge $50 for an aspirin, and who is getting all that easy money?

It's greed, and, no matter what you call yourself or who you blame, it's the in place rich and powerful that are fighting tooth and nail to keep their position unchanged. Obama doesn't stand a chance, and neither do the other 99% of us. This ongoing "occupy" movement is more important than most think because, like me, they are showing that they are fed up with the trillions of words, blame, and bullsh*t, that ultimately doesn't change a damned thing. We're not that far removed from revolution, in my opinion, and I'm ready to unsheath my sword and stand beside folks of any and all political persuasions if I thought we might actually fix our blatant problems. Edward.

[Terry Penrod]

.

It's good to vent your anger and frustration sometimes, Edward and we all need to stand up (hopefully together) for simple fairness, honesty and justice.

While there's no doubt our system is broken, driven by greed and stymied by special interests, I don't feel we are quite as close to all-out revolution as you seem to believe we are.

However, there are many millions of decent, hard-working Americans on the edge of a financial abyss right now looking down in fear at millions more that have already fallen in.

People are rightfully scared and they are getting more pissed-off by the minute.

If our leaders don't wake up and heed those warning signs soon, we just might see a violent, internal mass reaction unlike any in our nation's history.

While that would be a terrible shame and I hope things don't reach that boiling point, it could be the only way to stop this disgusting tsunami of BS and begin fixing what's wrong with the USA.

Cheers, Terry

[Impresario]

Truly depressing--we've trickled ourselves down to almost a life in the gutter.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57343397/census-data-half-of-u.s-poor-or-low-income/

[OldsterHolster]

Truly depressing--we've trickled ourselves down to almost a life in the gutter.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57343397/census-data-half-of-u.s-poor-or-low-income/

Yeah, it's serious! Terry says he doesn't think we are headed for revolution, but there doesn't seem to be any way out. For thirty years, the richest 5% have seen their incomes and quality of life rise, and the other 95% of us have seen them fall, dramatically, until there is no middle class left. No matter what words or excuses are offered, that 5% that controls the "system" have turned the rest of the population into slaves, and they are not much different from the dictators, despots, and ruling families that are being finally routed in the Arab world.

Our "democracy" has failed for all but that 5%, and the whole situation is approaching critical mass. What astounds me is that NOTHING is changing. The rich and greedy just don't get it, and their excuses and "spin" is losing effectiveness as the masses approach the point of "nothing left to lose." When I say revolution, I don't necessarily mean taking up arms and fighting in the streets, but something has to happen, and I doubt that it is going to be pretty. My one hope is that everyone exercises their right to vote and kicks every one of the bastards out of office. Our elected leaders need to be part of the 95%, not the 5%, and politics needs to go to hell!

I'm old, and being poor all my life has actually put me in good stead compared to the masses struggling to have a decent life, but even I see the quality of my life diminishing as prices rise and income falls. The signs are everywhere. Some places now require a tax, or fee, to sign up for fire protection. If you don't pay, the fire department will just watch your house burn down. WTF! How long before running water and electricity become luxuries for that same damned 5%, too? We're crumbling, folks, and we're running out of time to change things in any way except revolution. Edward.

[Rafal Dudek]

Thats why I got my guns fully loaded :):

[Rafal Dudek]

http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/updates/3246
Michele Bachmann Says Social Media, Google On Obama's Side

Damn facts! Always getting in the way of the GOP's message.

http://www2.timesdispatch.com/news/virginia-politics/2011/dec/28/1/paul-top-gop-primary-ballot-ar-1572784/
RICHMOND, Va. --
The state Republican Party will require voters to sign a loyalty oath in order to participate in the March 6 presidential primary.


^ I'm pretty sure that is illegal.

[Contagious Rage]

The rich need more money, don't you guys understand? It's only when their cup truly overflows can we hope to try and satiate our thirst on the meager rivulets that trickle down. I'm glad at least Fox News' GOP understands this. I say more tax breaks and bonuses for them. And let's keep letting people swing to and from positions at the SEC and whatever corporation they were supposed to be regulating, or achieving unusually high returns on their stocks. Nothing wrong with either of those. All of the corrupt, irresponsible, and immoral people that helped plunge us into this mess are already safely behind bars, and all those loopholes have been plugged. I think they deserve a bonus for that, too. Heckuva job.

There. Glad I made it just in time to make my yearly contribution to the political corner of the message board. Happy New Year's to everyone and--perhaps this time more than any other--try to enjoy it like it's our last.